SpiderChris: hi Bob Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: Good Morning Chris! rusty: morning! SpiderChris: hi chas Chas.: good afternoon!!! Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: It's nice having casual day at the office. Greetings everyone. Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: Hey Bob SpiderChris: everday is casual day for me ;-) Spider Joe: Hi Everybody! SpiderChris: hi Jim Bob Wright: Greetings, Bob SpiderChris: hi Bob W Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: I would like it if it was here all the time. Hate neckties Bob Wright: Howdy, Chris JimSmith-CMUG: Hi all Chas.: what are neckties??? Bob Wright: blah to ties rusty: We'll have B16 of TF Server later this afternoon. Bob Wright: Rusty: have you been able to determine why the server crashed earlier this week? rusty: It should fix the heap problems in b15 rusty: I think b15 was trashing memory Bob Wright: ahh... Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: I thought it was just me. Bob Wright: Chris: is there anyway to get MS to not only delete the email, but delete any attached files with the email, too? This is starting to become a problem with space Chas.: Jose - I'll need some of your TechTime/experience after this chat, if U please...our domain name became final.... Spider Joe: no problemo Chas rusty: I'm going to leave chat a little early today so I can get b16 finished up.. SpiderChris: Bob W, from the user directories? Mail Server doesn't delete the attachments, TF Server does (when the user is online...) SpiderChris: hi Brian Brian (Wang's): Hey chris Bob Wright: Chris: I mean when I delete an email, if it has an attachment it should be delted, too... Bob Wright: deleted ;) rusty: We'd haev to include an alert to the user about that... Chas.: question - have the recent improvements in TF server negated the need/use of maxum's RushHour??? rusty: + its a little hard to do, since at the time you delete the mail, TF Server doesn't necessarily know about the attachments. Bob Wright: Can Suzi be admended to deal with the user's attachment folder? Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: I think that would be bad. Many times I get a file I want to keep the file but I am finished reading the mail. I think it should be approached as a user problem. rusty: Yes Chas - that plus TF's superior caching mechanisms would make using Rush Hour a waste Bob Wright: But I think you should have at least be given an option to either keep the attachemtn or delete it Brian (Wang's): I tired the forward.txt and it works great. Is there anything else that the mail server can do. I think I asked last time about autoreply not being in there. I guess for group list you could setup a dummy account that has forwards to everyone in the group. Anything else you can do? rusty: Rush Hour only serves graphics, and it requires you to run a separate application. SpiderChris: BobW, yea it's in the works... i have a version that sorta does that, but at the moment it deletes too much, so i need to get that cleaned up before i can release it Bob Wright: Chris: ok, if we can get that much -- letting Suzi take care of OLD attachments -- I would be happy :) rusty: That sounds like the best solution to me Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: Did I hear that right there is going to be a Suzi 1.8? Bob Wright: well, the best solution is to at least have TF warn you that even though the message has been deleted, the attacfhment still exists or something SpiderChris: Brian, correct you can use that forward feature to setup groups... (the forward file will support up to 8k....). we dont have auto reply in there yet, but it's something i'm interested, along with support for notification... (using third party software like NotifyMe, etc) SpiderChris: Bob N, it will actually be 1.9. (i forget exactly what happened to 1.8 ;-) rusty: Rush Hour is good for Web Star 1.3 and prior servers only ( Since those Web* didn't cache files ). rusty: It's not useful for TF 5.1 or 5.5 or Web Star 2.0 Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: I guess it went wherever TF Server 5.3 and 5.4 went. :-) Brian (Wang's): 8k? forward.txt can only be 8k? Bob Wright: Bill Gates acquired those versions ;-) Bob Wright: ...ADMIT it ;)_ Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: Part of his active-x strategy no doubt :-) rusty: also 5.2 rusty: :) Bob Wright: Bill cloned himself and became....Rusty!??!? ;-) rusty: it MUST be Friday! Bob Wright: and payday :) Brian (Wang's): So Rusty you might be a towel boy after all?????? Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: and casual day rusty: hmm, dont know about that Brian (Wang's): Yes payday, payday is very goooooood. SpiderChris: Okay, here's a URL that y'all can try out... see if you can guess what new feature we've added to 5.5.... http://www.spiderisland.com/plugin.finger$bbs.spiderisland.com Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: I hear that 7.6.1 will be out in March and fix all the bugs in 7.6 SpiderChris: here's another one: http://www.spiderisland.com/slack.wisdom rusty: all ??? rusty: The biggest thing I 've seen is that it will report error numbers more accurately Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: Maybe that annoying type 11, I can live withthe rest for now. Gig me for 10 bucks huh? rusty: I really like 7.6, no problems for me. SpiderChris: Okay, i see noone figured it out.... TF Server 5.5 will have support for web server plugins! Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: I guess I ll have to set up a TF Plugins page now. I like 7.6 too now that I have spend $200 updating drivers for my CD, Hard Drive and Norton Utils. Chas.: rusty - is there anyone experienced with realaudio using TF??? rusty: :) Bob Wright: I am still waiting for a stable TF version with the 8550 so I can set up my realms rusty: Real Audo sets up its own server Brian (Wang's): So I can use lasso's plugin??? Are the plugins faster? rusty: It really doesn't have much to do with the web server rusty: The plugins are a lot faster Chas.: but in TF I could 'point' to the sound file I guess??? rusty: But w/File Maker you'll still have it's overhead, so it may not be much different than a CGI app rusty: Yes, with Real Audio you setup a file w/ the connection info to the server, the user downloads that and the real audio client reads the file and connects to the appropriate audio stream. rusty: Just like if you'd make a TF settigns file link that, then have NetScape tell TF User to open it. Brian (Wang's): I looked at that web server stats on the web that you suggested and it showed Unix running CGI being pretty slow (secs for response time). Makes the filemaker lasso team look good becuase it is so easy to set up. Chas.: we're hoping to mirror out telephone hotline with TF & RA...have yet to try the demo, as we're still waiting on our PPC rusty: I didn't see that about UNIX CGIs. Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: Was that the ApacheWeek articles Brian? Brian (Wang's): They showed setup time and delay in seconds. SpiderChris: Brian, plugins are much faster because they actually become part of the web server. There's no context switching when plugins are executed. Considerably more effecient than CGI's. Brian (Wang's): It was a link off of the apache article. rusty: do you have a URL to that? Bob Wright: Chris: we had toalked before about launching UM and just because the file is not called 'Teleusers' does not mean your file wont launch...did you look further into that? rusty: I'd expect these results ( fastest to slowest ) Plugins ( like Web* and ISAPI ), UNIX CGI, Mac CGI Bob Wright: toalked = talked rusty: at least as far as hits per second woudld go Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: http://www.apacheweek.com/issues/97-03-07 - I guess it was a link from that I didn't explore but evidently Brian did. rusty: Install time is a different story . Brian (Wang's): Let me look. Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: God he's loading Netscape while our servers running. SpiderChris: Bob W, any file that is a "teleusers" file can be opened by User Manager. You can actually have multiple database files open at the same time, although only the first one opened will work with TF Server SpiderChris: Bob W, the name doesn't have to be TeleUsers per say.... however, when you launch User Manager directly, it looks for a file called 'TeleUsers' in the same folder to open automatically.... Bob Wright: Chris: right...and if the file is not there you get NOTHING :/ Bob Wright: its a picky thing...... Bob Wright: I guess I could just make an alias to the file instead of to UM SpiderChris: Bob W, right.... if there's no database file, nothing will be opened. So you want it to automatically create a new database, is that the idea? SpiderChris: BobW, why not rename it to TeleUsers? Bob Wright: Chris: no, if I have a file called "97users" inside of the UM folder, I want it to open that file since no other UM file is in the folder Bob Wright: because I like to track previous users, I suppose I could call old users 'Teleusers96' or whatever Bob Wright: and current users could be Teleusers Bob Wright: I will just move my alias from UM to the file itself...no prob :) rusty: I don't see the link to CGI performance testing. Brian (Wang's): I found it just a second. Bob Wright: Here is another Q: is there any way to get TF to remember some settings with the Server when I upgrade? rusty: I t should remember all of them in the TF Server Prefs file ( sys folder ) Bob Wright: everytime I load a new Beta I have to go back and tell the Web Server where my directory is and other stuff rusty: If it doesn't, then the file is probably damaged Bob Wright: I say this nicely: I am no idiot, but it makes me reset everything Brian (Wang's): http://www.bsdi.com/products/internet-server/benchmarks/webperf Chas.: rusty...silly question...as TF has evolved into the premier server app that it has (brown nose) are there any thoughts to turn the client into more of a 'browser' Bob Wright: ahh.....I will throw that out then and create a new one :) Brian (Wang's): It talks about latency in seconds with a large load. rusty: No, our focus is on the server side. rusty: We want to make TF 5.5 the best avaialble Internet Server for PCs. Chas.: you mean its not already??? ;-) Brian (Wang's): I have been look into sql based web servers and Progress is the fastest I have seen so far. It doesn't help that everyone makes these hugh pages with to much graphics and stuff like modem users don't have a life. As speed goes filemaker and lasso on a mac is as fast as most of the SQL stuff and anything that uses ODBC can get real slow when it runs a lot of load. rusty: In many respects TeleFinder is the best server you can get. We want to make it best in every respect! rusty: And w/ better performance by a large margin! Brian (Wang's): How many other companies sell a product that does it all, Even Netscape has to sell a package of products to do what Telefinder does. rusty: Sonic sells a Suite that does a lot, but performance is not quite there rusty: + SoftArc ( if they ever release it ) will do some web serving in 4.0 rusty: not what you'd consider a true server from what I see tho. rusty: Integration is TeleFinder's strong point, along with adequate performance ( v 5.1 ) rusty: But 5.1 is quite a ways off the performance you can get from a UNIX or NT web server. rusty: That part we are changing. Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: I hear from my First Class buddies that they really have left the hobby operators in the dirt unless they were already in the loop. From the new pricing structure they aren't encouraging it. rusty: 5.5 will deliver performanace comparable to UNIX and NT servers and significanlty better than other Mac solutions. rusty: + it will have ( has ) a feature set that is far ahead of our competition. JimSmith-CMUG: and support has never been there Brian (Wang's): Faster is not the only thing when it comes to internet services. rusty: Speed and reliability are the reasons we see people go form Mac to Unix or NT Brian (Wang's): Database support and ease of use are big reasons. Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: I would think masochism would be in there somewhere as well. :-) Brian (Wang's): Have you seen the lastest netscape fast track server for NT it is hugh and takes up enough resources to crash some smaller NT servers. (Memory hog) rusty: You can't knock DB support on the Mac, I'd like to see something easier than Tango. rusty: I can tell you 4.0 browser won't make it to my disk rusty: 16mb of RAM is not worth it Brian (Wang's): SQL on NT is down right hard. Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: You know your video conferencing support is a fairly unique advantage. I would like to see you get more press. Brian (Wang's): I know of NT servers with 32meg that have been broken by netscape server. rusty: Well time for me to get back to the B16 release SpiderChris: I'm off to work on plugin support :-) rusty: see you all next week! Chas.: good luck!!! Bob Nunn Ą Headgap: Looking forward to it.... Bye everyone. SpiderChris: take care all!