SpiderChat

TeleFinder Chat from Tuesday, March 9, 1999 11 AM PST.
In attendance:
From Spider Island:
Sysops: Bob Nunn, Donald McHose, Mikael Fredriksson, Michael Davidson

Bob Nunn: hey
Donald McHose: hey hey Bob. how's things going?
Bob Nunn: Better now. Have had 5 root canals in the last 10 days. Been pretty sick.
Donald McHose: kaka !That should be illegal.
Donald McHose: Drugs man .....the only way to keep sanity in those times.
Bob Nunn: Yep. We couldn't find the tooth that was causing the problem. All of them are crowned. Yep don't remember much about the last week or so. Back to normal sort of. Still taking 1/2 darvocettes.
Donald McHose: Good deal. Nothing like a tooth or an eye to make life total misery.
Donald McHose: Your server seemed to exist just fine.
Bob Nunn: YUP don't want to go thru that again. Had one other time way back. Good thing you don't remember how painful this stuff is.
Donald McHose: Did you ever get into that free Tango CD?
Bob Nunn: Yep but never used it. Seemed too complex for me.
Donald McHose: Like bearing kids ( for the MOMS ).I thought that Tango was supposed to be a little friendlier my self.
Bob Nunn: Well I ain't no programmer so If I don't have really good examples to steal from then I am lost. These guys really need to do more of that.
Bob Nunn: I am working on a Sherlock PI for the Headgap...
Donald McHose: Too true. Good deal. something like SI 's search?
RT was asking about the win client. So far everything is ok here as far as I can tell. I did two transfers with no problems.
Bob Nunn: I finally got my AppleEG.acgi working so you can search now. Same technology. I will write a howto and put example package on E.G. first and then do the same for the Sherlock PI when I get it done.
Bob Nunn: If you want to try it it is on http://headgap.com/telefinder_pages.spml
Donald McHose: ok will do.
Bob Nunn: Use guest if you don't have an access. It is set up in a realm
Bob Nunn: I know that's kinda like locking your car doors with the windows down but it does seem to keep the idiots out.
Donald McHose: I have access..its just that I am putting in the first 15 min on a new work station. I will have to find an I.E. browser icon. ;-)
Bob Nunn: Probably has one somewhere transmitting all your personal details to headquarters ;-)
Donald McHose: ha ! could be. never know about the corp. big brother(s) here.
Donald McHose: bingo!
Bob Nunn: Well hopefully they aren't monitoring our conversation but you never know. With my search engine they can search for Donald and find all the times you were on the Spider Chats.
Michael Davidson: Hi guys
Bob Nunn: hey
Donald McHose: hi!
Michael Davidson: you guys talking bout big brother?
Bob Nunn: nope the pointy horned guy that runs Microsoft.
Michael Davidson: :)
Bob Nunn: I usually save all my bashing talk when O'Leary is on though.
Michael Davidson: Hey guys, where can I find info about how to allow users to modify their web space w/o using TF/user
Michael Davidson: Keeps him happy!
Michael Davidson: Hell, I have to admit, it makes me smile :)
Donald McHose: ha. Just get the man started...like a ball on a hill.
Bob Nunn: Well its either TF User or a Terminal Program for now. I kept hoping for an FTP plugin from Highlander or RT.
Michael Davidson: no other plugins
Donald McHose: I thought Jon had something for you Bob?
Michael Davidson: could you run an ftp server also and go that way??
Donald McHose: A PI from Highlander.
Bob Nunn: I currently have a few that just email me their archive and I put it up for them. Not that I know of. I can't figure out a way to set up any other FTP client with safe access to the mail box.
Michael Davidson: why can't it go by web, in the same way that it allows users access to files and conferences, it could allow for access to web space (user's mailbox)
Donald McHose: ouch!I thought that Netscape worked ok. I never tried it myself>
Bob Nunn: Jon had a trial version he was working on that apparently worked. I tested it with him but he wouldn't give me a copy.
Michael Davidson: type in your name & password and the user can access the mail folder with his name just like the Files spml does
Bob Nunn: But you cannot upload to the webspace folder over a browser directly.
Donald McHose: ahhh ok.
Michael Davidson: Ok, so right now, we cannot upload in our own mail folder (web space) but can we see in it???
Michael Davidson: if not, surely the spml that works for Files could be modified (maybe) to display the files therein.
Bob Nunn: I don't use HDS with popmail. I use regular mail and HDS so you can't open folders etc.
Bob Nunn: I had heard that when you use pop mail opening folders etc. works. Not sure though.
Michael Davidson: can a user of yours, bob, see what's in his web space?
Bob Nunn: I may know of a way to kludge it by installing a couple of web pages for the user. Will have to check that. No they cannot see their folders on HDS as it stands right now. Check your Headgap account sometime using it. They don't show up.
Michael Davidson: could the spml be modified (now it uses access group, it would need to return users name for the folder)
Michael Davidson: the Files spml, that is
Michael Davidson: or is it a template?
Michael Davidson: Am I nuts?
Bob Nunn: I ain't smart enough.
Donald McHose: Still that would be a one way deal. they could see the file folder but not upload to it.
Donald McHose: Why not use the client?
Michael Davidson: Yes don, but....
Bob Nunn: Let me look at the args for the NetScape upload.
Michael Davidson: there might be a relatively easy way to upload
Michael Davidson: Wouldn't this be a nice thing to have available?
Donald McHose: course it would be. It would at least follow a standard that most understand.
Michael Davidson: I think I could come up with a way to install files into a particular web space
Michael Davidson: You could have a web upload folder that used the Files Received Log to TRY to install an uploaded file into the users web space.
Michael Davidson: It could email a notification back to the user if the path was incorrect
Bob Nunn: Yep the durn FTP PI we all need is the way.
Michael Davidson: says who bob?
Bob Nunn: I do. All of the software for editing now includes the ability to auto update sites. Even BBEdit.
Michael Davidson: sorry, I thought you said "is ON the way"
Michael Davidson: not "is the way" (which is what you did say)
Bob Nunn: Wish it was. Need it worse that ever because of that.
Michael Davidson: Mail server could do it too though
Michael Davidson: mail to yourself with the path of the attachment as title
Bob Nunn: I think Jon kept thinking that the only way it would be acceptable is if it had all these bells and whistles he was thinking about. For me the simpler the better.
Michael Davidson: mail server would then have to move the file to the path instead of to the attachments folder
Bob Nunn: You could set up a mail account for person to send to with a path to their web space folder..
Michael Davidson: yes
Michael Davidson: It could be done with AppleScript, but I would like to see Mail Server do it
Bob Nunn: If they sent it as attachments though they would have to make sure an add /attachments/ to the path calls.
Michael Davidson: not sure what you mean Bob
Bob Nunn: I set up a system that sent attachments for image files. I just added attachments/ to the path call. That way when your html looks for the image it has the path to the attachment folder that mail server creates.
Michael Davidson: I send the file attached to the email with the path I want it to go to in the Title of the email. Mail Server sees it's from myself and looks at the title for the path it should put the file.
Bob Nunn: Didn't know you could do that.
Michael Davidson: But that would limit the organization that could be maintained by the user
Michael Davidson: NO, bob, Mail Server doesn't do it......YET
Bob Nunn: That could be very dangerous is probably why. I see a bunch of holes thinking about how that would work.
Michael Davidson: Why go to Ftp when it is way more eloquent to use one more step in Mail Server (check to see if mail is to your self and if its title is a path)
Bob Nunn: You would have no way to protect paths then.
Michael Davidson: it must be from your email account to your account (not relayed from another server)
Michael Davidson: in the same way that ftp does it (kinda)
Bob Nunn: I don't know how you would stop that if you opened it up. Probably why nobody has done it.
Bob Nunn: I think path grief is what kept Jon from sending me his PI.
Michael Davidson: Not sure what you mean stop it
Bob Nunn: If you can specify a path there is not an easy way to limit that path.
Michael Davidson: How would ftp pi be more secure?
Michael Davidson: Mail server would only accept paths too your own web space
Bob Nunn: Now you see. That's why I think Jon didn't go any further with the PI. Not sure though.
Michael Davidson: it would put it in YOUR web space ONLY
Bob Nunn: It may be easy to say and hard to do. Would have to ask RT or Jon about that.
Michael Davidson: where's RT anyway
Bob Nunn: I don't really know what has kept RT from doing it but if it was easy I think we would have already had it. I know he realizes the need. Have spoke to him about it.
Michael Davidson: it would definitely have to have a mechanism that emails the user if errors occurred in paths
Michael Davidson: Good, bob...Did you suggest the Mail Server/Email route?
Michael Davidson: or just some route (ftp, etc.)
Bob Nunn: Nope would be a second alternative though. Wouldn't be supported by editing software but would give alternative to those none TF users out there.
Michael Davidson: Did RT say he was going to miss today?
Bob Nunn: Form output to webspace might be an alternative if I can get the mailargs to work.
Michael Davidson: Do you think the Files template that Rusty made could be modified to allow for viewing user's mail folder.
Bob Nunn: Can't really see a way.
Bob Nunn: Can't really see anyway to do this without that pi after thinking more about how mail server handles the mail box.
Michael Davidson: Yes, it would take an extra step or two for mail server
Bob Nunn: Only kludge I can see is to set up a separate account for each user to send mail to. May play with that some.
Michael Davidson: But the code is in TeleFinder...the paths stuff
Bob Nunn: You can make a path for a different account to the web space folder in that users box. That would work.
Michael Davidson: AppleScript could do it by watching a general web space upload folder
Michael Davidson: so Joe would mail to Joe web and that mail folder would be Joe's web space?
Bob Nunn: Still path problems would make it necessary to send everything as attachments so they could be named properly and the user would have to be smart enough add /attachments/ to the path of everything. Too much trouble
Michael Davidson: I don't think that would work.
Michael Davidson: At least not well.
Bob Nunn: I am sure it would work but you are right in the fact that it wouldn't work well. It did okay for a database I built for sales to send overseas photo's and have them come up in the database automatically. Too complex for average Joe though.
Michael Davidson: yeah, nice idea though :)
Bob Nunn: They would email to images@bbs.wangs.com and the database would pull the picture file up with the item database using that.
Bob Nunn: Maybe RT will get back to looking at it eventually or Jon will when he gets out of school for the summer.
Michael Davidson: Yeah, you used FM to do what Mail Server COULD do or AppleScript
Bob Nunn: Yep..
Michael Davidson: cool, actually, give FM's scriptability, you could do a real slick implementation.
Michael Davidson: Hey bob, nice talking to ya again. Thanks for the ideas. Gotta go do some flyers for my kid.
Michael Davidson: see ya soon
Bob Nunn: Gotta run. On the phone sorry.