TeleFinder Chat Log

Text of TeleFinder Chat from Friday, December 12, 1997 11 AM PST.

In attendance:

From Spider Island: Rusty Tucker was on out

Sysops: Bob Nunn, Ken Sutherland, mikael fredriksson, Jim Smith, Bob Wright

Bob Nunn: <<joined the chat>>

Ken Sutherland: <<joined the chat>>

Ken Sutherland: Hi Bob

Bob Nunn: Hello Ken

Bob Nunn: We are in charge today the Cats away

Ken Sutherland: busy ?

Ken Sutherland: who, where when?

Bob Nunn: Yep finalized our 1998 Christmas Catalog and starting on promo materials for our January Gift shows.

Ken Sutherland: ahh, just finished in time then

Ken Sutherland: 8-)

Bob Nunn: Also about to finish TF Admin program v1.1

Ken Sutherland: ohh, tell me more

Bob Nunn: Nope missed our print window will have trouble getting it back before the first show.

Bob Nunn: I had sent up a very rough version to the SPML folder on SI. I can't demo what I am using since it require sysop access

Bob Nunn: I now have a demo version available on my site so people can see how it works. It is still rough but I made it a little better.

Ken Sutherland: great

Ken Sutherland: good to hear someone else is having fun with tf

Bob Nunn: You can hit it now at http://www.headgap.com/TFadmin/

mikael fredriksson: <<joined the chat>>

Bob Nunn: Hey mikael

mikael fredriksson: Hi!

Bob Nunn: Rusty is out today. Was going to talk about my Web Admin Program (SPML)

Ken Sutherland: hi Mikael, bob url wont work

mikael fredriksson: Ken any plans to make a package deal on OAT+Mail Plugin?

Bob Nunn: Site must be down. Let me call and check it.

Ken Sutherland: web home is ok

Jim Smith: <<joined the chat>>

Bob Nunn: http://206.30.216.253/TFadmin/ try again

Bob Nunn: Hey Jim

Jim Smith: Hi all

Ken Sutherland: Hi Jim, Bob, very nice

Bob Nunn: Just about finished updating that first page that comes up. The link buttons are hot on the demo so you can actually view the logs.

Ken Sutherland: back in a moment

Jim Smith: I am PO, on my 3rd 1710av monitor and now it down.

Bob Nunn: Not real logs though don't like showing my users passwords.

Bob Nunn: http://www.headgap.com/TFadmin/sysopstats.spml will bring up the command console

Ken Sutherland: what is purpose for pages, can you explain for all to read

Ken Sutherland: including those not here (grin)

Bob Nunn: The command console consolidates all of the log files and the siUM so that you can do things like cut and paste from the new user log to the UM..

Bob Nunn: I had set up several pages so that I could read my logs over the web. The command console just puts them all in one place so that I can quickly check the system over.

Bob Nunn: The SPML commands allow you to be able to insert the actual log files in the page. Each button calls to an spml page that uses the insert command.

mikael fredriksson: I get a Not Found on http://www.headgap.com/TFadmin/sysopstats.spml

Bob Nunn: One of the reasons I am posting it and have spend time setting up a demo is that I need help.

Bob Nunn: SO do I, I must not have uploaded that file. Sorry I have been thrashing it this morning trying to finish it. Not much of a demo without it.

Bob Nunn: Will have it up after the chat. I hope that you guys will download the file from SI's SPML file area a bit later today and will go back and look at it.

mikael fredriksson: this works http://206.30.216.253/TFadmin/sysop_admin/sysopstats.spml

Bob Nunn: Of course its the demo :-O

Bob Nunn: My fault not thinking right about the paths.

mikael fredriksson: it was a link on the demo page ;-)

Bob Nunn: About another 10 minutes and one more test and I should have it finished to upload to SI will call it v.1.1b

Bob Nunn: What I need help with is the formatted for the output of each of the log files. As you can see the <pre> command does not do justice to Suzie output.

Bob Nunn: I really would like the columns to line up. I am thinking table commands might help but it may be in the log file outputs???

Bob Wright: <<joined the chat>>

Bob Nunn: Perhaps someone with the Suzie code can do a bit of updating??

Ken Sutherland: what about the default font

Ken Sutherland: a mono font should allow line up of characters

Ken Sutherland: evening Bob

Bob Wright: greetings to all!

Bob Nunn: Not that well versed in html that what I was looking for. Can I call for Geneva or something?

Ken Sutherland: i think you can spec the font used, if the client has it you are ok

Ken Sutherland: if not it defaults

Ken Sutherland: you should also test the browser

Ken Sutherland: if it it is mac or pc

Ken Sutherland: dif font names etc...

Jim Smith: There is a HTML command-function that will allow for spacing, I think it is -> pre

Bob Nunn: I can do that. I am using the pre command. It works well on some and sucks on others.

Bob Nunn: That is why I suspect the output of suzie not being consistent.

Ken Sutherland: anyone here an expert in FileMaker pro?

Bob Wright: How come I can not get a "last modified" date to show on my page? I have used #echo LAST-MODIFIED and #flastmod but neither works

Bob Wright: Ken: I use FileMaker pro...I wont say I am an expert :)

Ken Sutherland: i will call u later for a chat then

Ken Sutherland: 8-)

Bob Nunn: Bob W. If you send me the exact code (paste it) and I will tell you what it is.

Bob Wright: haha

Bob Nunn: It could be something as silly as an extra space

Ken Sutherland: mk, did you release the info on tf 5.6 and HDS mail?

Bob Wright: 

Bob Nunn: Welcome.html has to be on the same level as the page calling for the flastmod command.

Bob Nunn: Or you will have to enter the path.

Bob Wright: BN: the file welcome.html contains that html tag...still nothing

Bob Nunn: Well if you did it absolutely correct it should report the date the file is modified. Cut and past the command from a page that it works on. Like one of Rusty's pages from the demo.

Bob Wright: I typed EXACTLY what you sent...nothing. Where are the demo pages?

Bob Nunn: I will mail you my SPML command page from the web docs in a bit.

Ken Sutherland: bn, is there any server mods needed or realms, mime,or something else

Bob Nunn: It should be in your web docs files in the 5.5 release.

Bob Wright: I have been doing html for almost three years...i don't know why I am having problems.

Ken Sutherland: just as silly

Bob Wright: maybe I am getting to used to Sitemill ;-O

Ken Sutherland: if u want problems try using windows 97

Ken Sutherland: if u want frustration use Cyberstudio

Bob Nunn: Bob do you have the www_mime.config file that runs with the newer tf betas?

Ken Sutherland: if u want to spend soooo much money buy 1st class

Bob Nunn: It has to be installed for spml to be served.

Ken Sutherland: ahh!

Bob Wright: hmm...I don't see a www_mime.config file

Bob Nunn: AHA!

Bob Wright: my files end with .html no .spml...is that the problem, too?

Bob Nunn: Yes for your page to call to spml it must be named .spm or spml

Bob Wright: so I have two problems :)

Bob Nunn: Before Internet Config allowed you to serve most mime types. I have an advance MIME config up in the sysop utils if you serve many different file types you may want do download BobsMimeConfig

Bob Wright: I need internet config installed, too?

Bob Nunn: The default Rusty provided in the beta's works for most people and is small and faster. No longer need IC

Bob Nunn: He took IC out since it was slowing down performance.

Bob Nunn: I serve many different file types and like to have browsers configured to load up the application so that they can run the files etc.

Bob Wright: I could not use your TFadmin files, because I don't generate all of the logs that you do :)

Bob Nunn: They also transfer better and show up with the icon so you can simply launch the file rather than have to load the file from within the application.

Bob Nunn: Take out the buttons you don't use.

Bob Wright: well, ya see...I have three computers on my desk so its easy to manipulate data :)

Bob Nunn: You really may not find admin all that useful but being able to review the newusers log from the web and paste them into the siUM is enough for me. I use it mostly for that or to run down a problem.

Bob Wright: so I need the www_mime.config file and the .spml extension and that should fix me up with the modification date?

Bob Nunn: Yep. You can call to all spml commands for your pages.

Bob Wright: well, since I am a school system, I don't allow users to sign themselves up. I have to protect the kiddies from unwanted outsiders :)

Bob Nunn: Does anybody ever print out the entire sysadmin.pdf for 5.6?

Bob Nunn: Or am I the only one who likes to read 171 pages of documentation?

mikael fredriksson: I will when rusty have fixed some font troubles with it (talked with him yesterday)

Bob Wright: I just keep in in digital format

Bob Wright: I wish I had some remote features as root like disconnecting users

Ken Sutherland: easy reading

mikael fredriksson: His acrobat distiller has made "fun" things with some fonts..

Bob Nunn: I was considering it. Will wait until he fixes up then. I like to read it sometimes not setting in front of a system. I was just curious. I looked at it briefly but on parts I don't understand I like to see them in print.

Bob Nunn: A forced user dump might be cool. My old CNET system had one.

Ken Sutherland: explain

Bob Wright: I am still having problems with that "OK for Alias" feature. Sometimes my users cant post messages...sometimes they can. Its real flaky.

Ken Sutherland: explain

Bob Nunn: If you set them right they work. I do keep mine simple though. I don't like having to change all of the paths out for my CD's and all my user types either.

Bob Wright: I have them set right! :) ....it does not make sense to work SOME OF THE time and not OTHER times :)

Bob Wright: I have a folder called news. Inside I have several other folders: Teachers, Students, Usenet, Schools. Inside of those folders I have more folders for the individual schools. I have aliases set up.

Bob Wright: For example, News --> School -> Norcom -> Students -> Usenet, colleagues

Bob Wright: Now colleagues is really at the ROOT level of NEWS

Ken Sutherland: have an idea I'm about to try , here are my thoughts.... Highlander is in need of about 6gb more space, instead of buying more drives on my scsi chain i have a old p120 that i don't really use and am planning to load NT server and services for macintosh on it and act as a server for TF, i can get 9GB IDE drives for $300 and plan to retire some of my scsi drives, your comments & thoughts

Bob Wright: but I wanted ALL high school students to see it, so I make an alias of it and put it in all of the students high news

Bob Wright: I think made an INVISIBLE link (ok for alias) to the NEWS folder.

Bob Wright: Some of my high school students can post to colleagues...some cant.

mikael fredriksson: HFS+ gave me 500 MB extra on my 2 GB HD at work...

Bob Wright: Then, for those who cant, I try a setting...it does not work..I put it back and BINGO they can print

Bob Wright: So who has an idea for me with this?

Bob Nunn: Make sure all your users are on the same TF user version. Run Norton and rebuild your desktop. If it ain't that then you may have found a bug.

Bob Wright: All users have the latest TF Client version.

Ken Sutherland: have you tried changing the file alias cint value in tf server

Bob Wright: Ken: no,

Bob Wright: I had a student email today and say he could not post. I logged in as him and he couldn't. I changed his setting and it still would not post. When I put his setting back, he could post. Now that is WEIRD

Bob Nunn: I run NT at work Ken and Wang's Online New Product is on one NT server partition and Web Space is on another. Works good. I wouldn't do it without someone maintaining the NT for me though.

Bob Nunn: I think Ken may have it. Sounds like you may be running over the total amount of aliases TF ALLOWS, did I say that right Ken?

Ken Sutherland: yes

Bob Wright: I am about to set up my NT network at my home. I hope to start with that this weekend. I want to be able to surf the net from any room in the house

Ken Sutherland: the default is 50 aliases, i change it to 200

Bob Wright: You mean TF Allows for a certain amount of aliases?

Bob Wright: where do I change that?

Bob Nunn: As the server runs and people access aliases it stores the paths and it eventually runs out.

Bob Wright: I have like 75 access groups, each with about 5 aliases each :-O

Bob Nunn: When you restart it starts over.

Bob Nunn: Have TF Server close and restart at night.

Ken Sutherland: do u really need 75 access groups

Bob Wright: Restart the Web server or TF?

Bob Nunn: Shut TFS down and then restart it.

Bob Wright: Ken: I have thirty schools...I need access for teachers....students....librarians...and principals at EACH school

Bob Wright: so that is FOUR access levels per school

Bob Wright: so I really have like 120 access groups :O

Bob Nunn: I haven't looked at changing it in CINT is it obvious what to change Ken?

Ken Sutherland: hmm why not limit access group to bbs access only,use HDS mail for mail

Ken Sutherland: yup

Bob Wright: heh?

Ken Sutherland: towards the bottom of the cint list

Bob Nunn: BobW he is talking about using Resedit to change the value. Shouldn't be hard but do it on a copy.

Ken Sutherland: why all the different access , ...... forget it my brain is gubbed

Bob Nunn: Probably need to raise the ram a bit.

Ken Sutherland: by at least 8mb

Steve Messimer: <<joined the chat>>

Bob Wright: I have TF set for 32mb of ram...I have over 100mb available :)

Ken Sutherland: hello big boy

Bob Nunn: If you change the CINT from 50 to 200 for aliases it will take more memory than you are using

Ken Sutherland: chuck another 32 in for fun

Bob Nunn: It could also slow down your performance one it loads up the paths for all of those. I would restart at night the way you are running and bring it up fresh.

Ken Sutherland: ram that is

Steve Messimer: <<left the chat>>

Bob Nunn: Haven't you ever noticed that when you first open an area with a lot of aliases in it that it takes a while the first time after a reboot but it speeds up after you or someone else has been in it?

Bob Wright: nope :)

Bob Nunn: You are on a faster mac I forgot. Speed forgives many things.

Bob Wright: I did notice that on the 6100, not on the 9500

Bob Nunn: It's getting late anyone have anything else. I hope I have the log today.

Jim Smith: <<left the chat>>

Bob Wright: i gotta run...thanks for the chat

Bob Wright: thanks for the help Bob N

Bob Wright: and Ken :)

Bob Nunn: See you guys.

Bob Wright: <<left the chat>>