TeleFinder Chat Log

Text of TeleFinder Chat from Thursday, July 30, 1998 6 PM PDT.

In attendance:

Sysops: Jim DeHaven, Gary Clarke, Donald McHose, Bob Nunn, Jim Smith, Daniel O'Leary

Jim DeHaven: hi Bob
Jim DeHaven: hi Gary
Gary Clarke: Hi Jim
Bob Nunn: hey
Gary Clarke: Sorry, hi Bob
Jim DeHaven: what's up? anything new?
Donald McHose: Screech bang!! East Coast says hey ;-)
Gary Clarke: I've taken it off for the time being, not sure if it runs correctly, I wanted to check with Rusty
Jim DeHaven: b23?
Bob Nunn: Hey, Type 2 error. Guess that means you got too much crap loaded.
Bob Nunn: I think it is 23. Has the processor for uploads script with it.
Jim DeHaven: can you use spml to play a sound?
Jim DeHaven: to load a qt movie for example that would automatically play?
Bob Nunn: You can use it to play sounds at random but html will play sounds straight up. You can even spec what type of browser
Jim DeHaven: I want to put a clock tower that chimes
Bob Nunn: Learn HTML 4 in 10 minutes is a good one. Click thru my site to amazon I get credit.
Bob Nunn: I made 34 bucks so far.
Jim DeHaven: I was also thinking of perhaps having the sun pass overhead maybe in 1 hour steps using a ray dream 3d picture
Jim DeHaven: or actually a bunch of them
Jim DeHaven: wouldn't be that hard in winter
Jim DeHaven: since we have so few daylight hours here
Jim DeHaven: does this make sense?
Bob Nunn: The new graphic converter will pull a series of images and turn them into an anim
Bob Nunn: gif 89a anim that is.
Jim DeHaven: well--this would be a very slow animation
Jim DeHaven: and so that is why I thought using the time function in spml
Jim DeHaven: to switch images
Jim DeHaven: would work nicely
Bob Nunn: Pretty cool idea. Have it show the one that matches the outside?
Jim DeHaven: yes
Jim DeHaven: maybe even a comet late at night
Jim DeHaven: or perhaps a mugging at 3 AM
Jim DeHaven: the possibilities are endless
Bob Nunn: You ll have to advertise it on SI when you get it working . I would like to see it.
Jim DeHaven: OK--well I will be aiming for September when the kiddies get back from vacation
Jim DeHaven: has anyone here had trouble or heard anything about strange occurrences with JAZ drives
Jim DeHaven: I had a whole bunch of them go bad all at once
Bob Nunn: Never seen one in public. The zips cause bus errors and other SCSI probs.
Jim DeHaven: I thought maybe I had gotten mayonnaise on the cartridge
Jim DeHaven: something like that
Bob Nunn: Did you try the ambulance?
Jim DeHaven: and the mayonnaise spread from drive to drive--but also this seemed to happen coincidentally with the new drivers
Jim DeHaven: no I didn't
Jim DeHaven: I tried Norton which the IOMEGA people suggested
Bob Nunn: I have better luck recovering opticals that way.
Jim DeHaven: but I was wondering if their drivers were actually altering the firmware in the drives
Bob Nunn: I run it 6-10 times until it works. Then I run Norton.
Jim DeHaven: the Iomega folks were very helpful as you might guess
Bob Nunn: Computer Voodoo at its finest.
Jim DeHaven: yes--sounds it
Jim DeHaven: you know I am starting to get a complex about these late night chats
Bob Nunn: We have about 200-300 opticals in our image library and we send them all over.
Jim DeHaven: rusty doesn't seem to love us as much
Donald McHose: He did say he would show..didn't he ;-)
Bob Nunn: He wanted to be able to duck our early Friday during the summer with the kids some I think.
Jim DeHaven: I am listening to "Teardrops on my Keyboard" in the background
Jim DeHaven: well--this sure counts as early Friday
Bob Nunn: Perhaps he is busy coding b24 with all kinds of cool things and has lost track of the time?
Jim DeHaven: do you think rusty is really Jim Smith?
Jim DeHaven: And that I have hurt his feelings?
Donald McHose: Ha!
Bob Nunn: Could be. Checking to see if we are talking about him.
Bob Nunn: Don't say anything too bad I don't edit the logs that much.
Jim DeHaven: actually--I am buying still another copy of his server software
Jim DeHaven: so I feel a certain degree of liberty
Jim DeHaven: I have convinced our administrators that we need still another TF server
Donald McHose: did ya'll see that file transfer with 8.5 and apple share 6.0?New OT and networking screams.
Jim DeHaven: to house all the students' web pages
Bob Nunn: I may soon. We are opening web stores for the company I work for and We will set up another server soon. I was going to run FMPro and just link the existing but got to thinking about the user files. Don't want sales mixed up with customers
Jim DeHaven: no--don where is that?
Donald McHose: I think it was on MacCentral.?
Donald McHose: could have been reality though.
Donald McHose: anywho
Donald McHose: 100 meg transfer in 14 secs
Bob Nunn: The local user group showed us the iMac intro by Jobs. Racing the new 400 MHz Pentium II with the little iMac. Want to borrow the tape to show the IS guys.
Jim DeHaven: oh--now that does sound cool
Donald McHose: 30% better than NT ;-)
Jim DeHaven: that is absolutely exciting
Bob Nunn: Need to get that too don't I.
Jim DeHaven: visions of TV over our intranet
Bob Nunn: Pirate PPV movies????
Jim DeHaven: Yes-- I saw the tape
Jim DeHaven: Yes--underground Barney the Dinosaur tapes
Donald McHose: the QT version is a scream
Bob Nunn: I could get into broadcasting..... Bring office productivity to its knees.
Jim DeHaven: how did they hook up the computers don?
Jim DeHaven: did they have a fiber optic or something between them?
Jim DeHaven: well--maybe not
Jim DeHaven: I guess that is roughly the full speed of a 100 megahertz card
Jim DeHaven: true?
Donald McHose: Good question. I'll find the URLs and send them to ya or a copy of the note. No cat 5 over 100 base T
Jim DeHaven: when is this supposed to become public? Will TF automatically run faster under that?
Jim DeHaven: I sure would appreciate seeing that
Donald McHose: I am still looking for Bobs ref. to cat 6 ;-)
Donald McHose: TF will certainly run faster.
Bob Nunn: TF will certainly run longer. There is an OT bug that kills it every so often.
Jim DeHaven: really?--didn't know that--what is the bug?
Bob Nunn: What kind of Web Hits per day do u get?
Donald McHose: Its in the either net protocol whatever
Jim DeHaven: me? not many--only about 5000 per day max.
Bob Nunn: That's not bad really.
Jim DeHaven: although many of them are for streaming video
Bob Nunn: You have enough traffic you should have had a crash log or two by now.
Jim DeHaven: crash log?
Bob Nunn: U run MacsBug?
Jim DeHaven: only when I have to--I did it once way back
Jim DeHaven: found out that Inter net config was in conflict with version 5.6
Bob Nunn: Well If you crash with anything it will give you clues some of the time to why.
Bob Nunn: U running 1.3 OT?
Jim DeHaven: rusty found that out actually
Jim DeHaven: yes
Bob Nunn: Now we know why he changed the mime configs to work outside of IC
Jim DeHaven: it was a relatively obscure thing
Bob Nunn: The text formatted file is actually probably faster as well.
Jim DeHaven: in which, if you tried to access the same realm but with successively different access groups
Jim DeHaven: you crashed
Jim DeHaven: very reproducible
Bob Nunn: U probably have a lot of groups?
Jim DeHaven: didn't happen in 5.5--so I was doomed for quite some time
Jim DeHaven: yes quite a few--my guess is 30 to 40
Jim DeHaven: I don't know if that is a lot
Jim DeHaven: it seems like a lot to me
Bob Nunn: With a school system that makes sense. I only have 3 groups on my corp. site and about 6 on my hobby site.
Jim DeHaven: anyway--getting rid of Internet config fixed it right up
Jim DeHaven: yes--my hobby site was like that
Bob Nunn: You ever set up other mime types for use with TF?
Jim DeHaven: I expect to have only a few groups on the student site
Jim DeHaven: Bob--yes I did
Jim DeHaven: but I think I am now using your version with a few amendments
Bob Nunn: We have been serving PDF formatted material via the web. With the new PI you can do searches.
Jim DeHaven: which plug in is that?
Bob Nunn: Adobe Acrobat 3.01 has a browser PI.
Jim DeHaven: Oh--I thought you meant there was some server PI--OK
Jim DeHaven: did you all read the MacWorld reviews of the web servers?
Jim DeHaven: spider island was nary to be found
Bob Nunn: I haven't tested it with IE explorer but with NS it works great. Cool being able to key in a stock number.
Bob Nunn: Yep RT needs to release 5.7 and get some good press for sure.
Donald McHose: It was not listed in NETPRO either...very sad .
Donald McHose: Something has to be done. Alot of sysops out there think its (TF ) is gone.
Bob Nunn: Have you been to websitegarage.com and had the system do a diagnostic on your site?
Jim DeHaven: no--never heard of that Bob
Bob Nunn: They test 6-8 things and tell you how you rated and why you scored low. Good thing and free. Taught me a bit.
Donald McHose: Do tell Bob..How did ya rate?
Bob Nunn: Excellent of course. but just plug in headgap.com and see for yourself. I do have a few lower ratings do to special terms in my pages. It reads TF as a misspelling for example
Jim DeHaven: just went there--lots of interesting looking stuff
Bob Nunn: What it did show me was that some of my meta tags were too large etc.
Bob Nunn: It told me the rules to play by then so I fixed them.
Bob Nunn: They also have graphics tune-up. Works good. Put in url and it shows you smaller files degrading color etc. bit by bit.
Donald McHose: So its a html site editor check-up. Not so much a speed thing.
Bob Nunn: Find smallest with acceptable quality and download it to replace your fat one.
Bob Nunn: Yes it rates loading speed etc. Hop on and put in an url.
Jim DeHaven: yes--I just did it
Jim DeHaven: it got mad at my rollover buttons
Jim DeHaven: they are sloooow
Donald McHose: I'll try after this chat. I'm on the kids P575 with 12 meg ram . Won't handle a browser load and client at same time.
Bob Nunn: Well you knew that probably but sometimes it will point out a few oversights. Not a bad deal for the money.
Donald McHose: Have any of you tried Page Charmer stuff ?
Bob Nunn: Yes but I had to buy another drive to unarchive it on. Cool looking.
Jim DeHaven: here I go again'----what is page charmer?
Bob Nunn: Its in the Amug archive. JAVA stuff you can rob.
Jim DeHaven: just got their new bbs in a box today
Jim DeHaven: for the new student site
Jim DeHaven: oh yeah
Bob Nunn: Its a whopper though. When you undo it. Cool effects.
Jim DeHaven: where is a good source for windows shareware?
Jim DeHaven: the AMUG disk has not been updated for a couple of years
Bob Nunn: Too much not selectively sorted. I wish there was a good one.
Jim DeHaven: well--any poor ones you could recommend
Bob Nunn: Quality not quantity. Try Walnut Creek they are on the net.
Jim DeHaven: the windows people really touch my heart when they get all sad about being neglected
Jim DeHaven: walnut creek
Donald McHose: Win users are in need of good viral stuff always. Can ya'll say CIH.
Bob Nunn: Walnut Creek has a lot of collection CDs I get my INFO Mac archives from them.
Jim DeHaven: heh
Bob Nunn: Probably a bit stale but better than nothing.
Bob Nunn: FileDudez.com is a good collection site.
Jim DeHaven: what about images, sounds, karaoke's etc.?
Jim DeHaven: Ok filedudez
Bob Nunn: They have current stuff up well organized. I swipe utils for my system from them for the PC boys.
Donald McHose: Jim do you use Claris for w-processor?
Bob Nunn: My MOD file collection started with the Ultimate MOD CD from Walnut Creek.
Jim DeHaven: actually I still prefer MacWrite don--why do you ask?
Bob Nunn: I still use MacWrite II as well. Best thing going. Loads fast and is small.
Jim DeHaven: I feel like such an anachronism--'specially since they stopped making it
Jim DeHaven: absolutely
Jim DeHaven: word reminds me of Cartman on "weight gain 4000"
Bob Nunn: Excel 4 was the last real Mac version also.
Jim DeHaven: filedudez did not show up on yahoo
Bob Nunn: Just try filedudez.com
Jim DeHaven: ok it's filedudes
Donald McHose: That should work. I'll send notes in Mac Write if I can find the translators.
Bob Nunn: If you need them Don let me know I will archive them up and send them to you.
Bob Nunn: You can use the Claris filters by the way.
Bob Nunn: They work mostly with MacWrite.
Donald McHose: Thanx I'll give it a try.
Jim DeHaven: we have Claris works around here somewhere anyway though
Daniel O'Leary: I'm late!
Jim DeHaven: OK my next goal is still another g3
Jim DeHaven: hello Daniel
Bob Nunn: I may be able to weasel one at the office with the net project.
Daniel O'Leary: Hi all.
Jim DeHaven: I am the unofficial chat bot
Donald McHose: May the Great one grant you and I that one !
Bob Nunn: Hey
Daniel O'Leary: Grin. Did you guys see the "Pentium Bug"?
Donald McHose: I just finished a 30K grant request.. going for the gold.
Donald McHose: sux?
Jim DeHaven: The Pentium Bug? A new novel by Crichton?
Daniel O'Leary: a couple of ex-motorola engineers etched "bill sux" into the chip.... hahahah
Jim DeHaven: that is nice
Donald McHose: That was a trip to see.
Daniel O'Leary: you can see it under an electron microscope...
Jim DeHaven: damn!!!!
Jim DeHaven: now I have to ask for an electron microscope
Donald McHose: They do not work for Intel no longer though.
Daniel O'Leary: I have the image here.
Daniel O'Leary: Will place it and the Time report on it on my website.
Jim DeHaven: "they'll never get a job in this town again"
Daniel O'Leary: Too Damn funny.
Jim DeHaven: how many infected chips?
Jim DeHaven: millions I hope?
Daniel O'Leary: Loads!!!
Jim DeHaven: does this have to be recalled under the Communications Decency Act?
Donald McHose: a whole LOT shipment
Daniel O'Leary: Why? it is "art"...
Daniel O'Leary: hehe
Jim DeHaven: I wonder if our campus policy on "computer indecency"
Jim DeHaven: will require us to get rid of all out Pentium machines
Bob Nunn: Should be able to get a federal grant for that don't ya think.
Jim DeHaven: "come on up and look at my etchings"
Daniel O'Leary: WinHoze also has a problem with email erasing their HDs with everything but Eudora (and prolly TF)
Jim DeHaven: yes--this was in Rusty's "thought for the day"?
Daniel O'Leary: So little time, so many barbs.
Bob Nunn: Think it is because the path info is in the mail messages.
Jim DeHaven: I have sent that info to our Internet person
Jim DeHaven: she very wisely chose NT boxes for our campus servers
Jim DeHaven: there is only one small island of sanity in the physics lab
Daniel O'Leary: hahahahaha
Bob Nunn: More people should look at stuff with BBEdit.
Daniel O'Leary: Especially WORD docs.
Donald McHose: When will the World get REAL DIFFERENT
Bob Nunn: When something happens that cost some big bucks. Won't be long the way its going.
Daniel O'Leary: I have become even more outspoken in my criticism of Wintel at work.
Daniel O'Leary: I have a "Wall of SHAME" on the outside of cube.
Bob Nunn: I wouldn't have thought that would be possible from our conversations.
Donald McHose: I'll get that 8.5 / networking speed thing to ya all. It's definitely a powerful tool in the NT VS. Mac war.
Jim DeHaven: oh yes--I really want to see that
Daniel O'Leary: It is, Bob... I have placed articles about security, cost and support problems of Windows and Intel.
Bob Nunn: Maybe you should send me a few attachments when you get some choice stuff. I will anonymously mail them to our IS group.
Jim DeHaven: the war here feels like it is going in our direction--at least temporarily
Daniel O'Leary: My internal website has a lot of stuff on it too.
Bob Nunn: The Jobs intro to iMac video is pretty good.
Donald McHose: I think so too. People are starting to take notice. SSooooo is the Justice Dept. ;-)
Daniel O'Leary: A very good executive narrative on the business and support issues can be found at www.aberdeen.com
Daniel O'Leary: the rest can be found with a side junket to www.rootshell.com, www.antionline.com, and bugtraq.
Jim DeHaven: Oh it convinced lots of people around here--some very stubborn students now wish they had a Mac--very hopeful feeling to corrupt the minds of the young
Daniel O'Leary: Bob where can I get that?
Bob Nunn: Our user group got it in a packet Apple sent out.
Daniel O'Leary: I would like that, and the video of the G3 vs. the Pentium.
Donald McHose: Are you talking about the Pentium II vs. iMac clip?
Bob Nunn: They showed the PowerBook on the same tape. When the iMac beat badly the hottest pentium II 400 MHz.
Daniel O'Leary: And next up on the agenda, Alta-Vec 128-bit extensions to PowerPC in the "G4"
Daniel O'Leary: Or perhaps, Copper... maybe BOTH!
Jim DeHaven: oh this is the Motorola mmx chip?
Daniel O'Leary: JD, the MMX is extensions to the Pentium instruction set.
Daniel O'Leary: the hardware is not changed.
Bob Nunn: One of the multimedia guys stood up in the last meeting and showed where his 266 Pent. Notebook had taken the crease out of his pants from sitting on his lap.
Daniel O'Leary: Alta-Vec has a separate execution unit.
Daniel O'Leary: 13X pentium speed.
Jim DeHaven: yes--but I meant its function was to speed up mm
Daniel O'Leary: at the same clock rate.
Jim DeHaven: sounds like the McDonald's lawsuit
Jim DeHaven: business man burns Kahones with 266 MHz pentium
Donald McHose: Well the 296 PowerBook gets rather warm also now..alot of scary tales out there.
Daniel O'Leary: Hehe... Copper PPC's will fix that.
Jim DeHaven: we just bought 2 233 mhz Pentium
Donald McHose: Very true!
Bob Nunn: Practical uses press your pants on the road.
Jim DeHaven: they are really hot!!!!
Donald McHose: I luv it!
Daniel O'Leary: That is why Apple came out with the bunny guy on fire video.
Daniel O'Leary: hehe
Jim DeHaven: in the literal sense of the word--I mean they heated up a big wooden lab bench
Donald McHose: sun of a gun
Jim DeHaven: didn't see bunny guy
Bob Nunn: Get the QT vid off the Apple Site. Worth the download time.
Daniel O'Leary: I have it here Jim, but you gotta come get it (grin)
Daniel O'Leary: Actually you can get it from Apple.
Daniel O'Leary: I have that, Snail, and Steamroller.
Jim DeHaven: our firewall blocks the apple ftp site grrrrr
Jim DeHaven: since I have a server that bypasses the firewall
Bob Nunn: Pull it off mine then.
Daniel O'Leary: Or mine.
Jim DeHaven: I am the only one on campus that can get there directly
Jim DeHaven: thanx
Donald McHose: Gots to run -) big day in the am. See ya and I'll be in touch with ammo.
Jim DeHaven: why do some firewalls block some ftp sites?
Daniel O'Leary: Worries about viruses for WinHoze.
Bob Nunn: The IS guys have no idea how to configure those things mainly.
Jim DeHaven: that's what I thought (Bob)--but what should I suggest to her
Jim DeHaven: IOMEGA is also blocked
Jim DeHaven: and several others
Jim DeHaven: MacTCPWatcher
Daniel O'Leary: JD. Does your firewall block AppleShare?
Bob Nunn: Well I get a local guy to come in after hours and fix things.
Jim DeHaven: says something about no return address
Daniel O'Leary: Try kz.eaze.net
Bob Nunn: Running Proxy software I bet.
Jim DeHaven: no--that's next
Jim DeHaven: proxy server this month
Bob Nunn: That will finish you off.
Jim DeHaven: I am dreading it
Bob Nunn: Raise hell early and often.
Jim DeHaven: what problems should I anticipate?
Daniel O'Leary: Actually, just get an account on the proxy host.
Jim DeHaven: and dan
Bob Nunn: Another Microsoft conspiracy.
Jim DeHaven: I don't know the answer to the AppleShare question
Daniel O'Leary: Try it...
Bob Nunn: Lets fix it so the apple guys cant work anymore.
Daniel O'Leary: now.
Jim DeHaven: I can configure an AppleTalk network on **some** of our computers
Jim DeHaven: seems to depend on which hub we are plugged into
Bob Nunn: And you can't find anybody who knows why and if you did they would tell you there is an NT bug that keeps it from working. Next version will fix it.
Daniel O'Leary: Hmmm packet filtering....
Bob Nunn: Did you ever see the NT dancing directory problems?
Jim DeHaven: we have a Novell server that does not run an AppleShare client
Daniel O'Leary: yes... hahahahahaha.
Jim DeHaven: Bob--nope
Bob Nunn: I still live with it.
Jim DeHaven: AppleShare gateway
Jim DeHaven: pardon me
Bob Nunn: Has improved hand-eye coordination skills in my department.
Daniel O'Leary: grin.
Bob Nunn: But if we were to buy version 4 and take 6 months to get it working smoothly we could fix it. Assuming we didn't have to swap out motherboards on the server etc.
Bob Nunn: Like they did on the rest of the servers.
Daniel O'Leary: best way to solve it is to nuke the LoseTel boxes.
Bob Nunn: Well if I had my way we would be running Apple thru-out. May get my way eventually.
Daniel O'Leary: I'm working the issue hard here.
Bob Nunn: They have no arguments left. Faster Cheaper Stable is a good convincer in a business.
Jim DeHaven: Our server did a lot of convincing this year
Jim DeHaven: many people use its e-mail
Daniel O'Leary: grin...
Jim DeHaven: in preference to the school's official site
Jim DeHaven: it's email is gated through my home/hobby system
Bob Nunn: Less virus problems and drag and drop are waking up a few folks at work. With Office 98 they really can't say anything anymore.
Jim DeHaven: thereby completely avoiding the school's mail server
Bob Nunn: Use the NT boxes for a print server for the warehouse
Bob Nunn: Since we have several they will have the needed backups. That's my plan
Jim DeHaven: print server's
Bob Nunn: Guess I had better call it a night. See you guys next Tues.
Jim DeHaven: I remember the day last fall
Jim DeHaven: bye
Daniel O'Leary: ok.... see you later.
Jim DeHaven: when the President's printing of personnel files showed up in the student computer lab
Jim DeHaven: "I am not making this up"
Daniel O'Leary: I would not have a Wintel box for any reason.